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tp4506 lipo charging

Q: TP4056 keep shorting / dropping voltage when connected to XL6009. I found 2 solutions, which one is the best?

David McTravordHere is the electronics, I took the picture after I cut the wires, the measurement being done before the wires being cut. Basically, the voltage keeps dropping on C, from supposedly 4V to only 1V when I connect it to XL6009, without connecting the fan. Based on few searching, I discovered this p…

voltage tp4056 short

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

Are you using XL6009 from HaoYu or XLsemi? XLSemi is the best. XL6009 180KHz 60V 5A Switching Current Boost DC/DC Converter Datasheet – HaoYu/ XLSemi (1) haoyuelectronics.com/Attachment/XL6009/… (2) xlsemi.net/datasheet/XL6019%20datasheet-English.pdf

Did you get your TP4056 from eBay or AliEx/Amazon? (1) aliexpress.com/w/…, TP4056 1A Standalone Linear Li-lon Battery Charger with Thermal (2) Regulation in SOP-8 – NanJing Top Power ASIC tp4056.com/d/tp4056.pdf

Why you use TP4056? XL6009 already has built in over voltage and over current protection. I think you can forget TP4056 and use a polyFuse for extra short circuit/over current. protection.

XL6009 4A is an overkill. I would suggest to instead use the popular cheapy LM2596 3A LM2596 module aliexpress.com/w/wholesale-lm2596-module.html

David McTravord

David McTravord

33

@tlfong01 I don’t know, the local seller didn’t specify where they bought it and what kind of brand it belongs.

@tlfong01 and for the module, then how can I charge the battery with? I use TP4056 for charging. And the LM2596, I’ll look into it.

@PStechPaul here the diagram imgur.com/a/EtQtYi1

tlfong01

tlfong01

Ah, there seems some misunderstanding somewhere. PStechPaul’s diagram is good to clarify things. Let me look at the whole picture and give you a quick reply, perhaps during weekend.

David McTravord

Nov 26, 21:19

Alright, don’t worry, I also still waiting for the replacement XL6009 to arrived, in case if mine is defective, or the marking actually flipped. If you need any more information, just chat me here, or if you have a discord, chat me there McTee261#6133

15 hours later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

Nov 27, 11:52

A quick reply.

Your questions:

Q1 – @tlfong01 I don’t know, the local seller didn’t specify where they bought it and what kind of brand it belongs. – David McTravord 16 hours ago
Q2 – @tlfong01 and for the module, then how can I charge the battery with? I use TP4056 for charging. And the LM2596, I’ll look into it. – David McTravord 16 hours ago

My quick answers:

A1 – Your hardware setup diagram is not very clear. We need to use some reference for discussion. Perhaps we can use the following AliEx ad.

5V 1A 18650 TP4056 Lithium Battery Charger Module/Board With Protection Dual Functions Micro/Type-C USB – TZT 5-Star Store, AliExpress HK$10/(5pcs)
aliexpress.com/item/…

(see full text)

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

Nov 27, 12:30

AliEx TZT Lipo charger has two versions: with or without protection IC (HW01).

Now references for HW01:

(1) i.stack.imgur.com/SqNtn.jpg

(2) DW01 One Cell Lithium-ion/Polymer Battery Protection IC Datasheet – PingJing Semi
datasheet.lcsc.com/lcsc/…

tlfong01

tlfong01

Nov 27, 13:07

Now I assume your TP4056 modules has HW01 built in. Pls let me know otherwise.

2 hours later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

Nov 27, 14:58

Now HW01 is control the dual N-channel power mosfet for charge/discharge current limiting. So we need to study the mosfet datasheet.

FS8205A Dual N-Channel Enhancement Mode Power MOSFET FortuneSemi
ic-fortune.com/upload/…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

Nov 27, 15:14

If the OP’s TP4056 has no built in HW01 current protection cct, then I would recommend thi one from AliExpress:

1S 3.7V 4A li-ion BMS PCM 18650 Battery Protection Board PCB for 18650 lithium Battery Double MOS – $2.3
aliexpress.com/w/…

tlfong01

tlfong01

Nov 27, 15:31

TZT’s TP4056 module recommends weak MT3608 boost converter and not the heavy duty XL6009. To play safe, I would start with MT3608 and perhaps LM2596 step down converter later.

7 hours later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

Nov 27, 22:34

I am drafting a block diagram for the single 3.7V Lipo battery charger.

user image

13 hours later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

Mon 11:06

The OP is using a XL6009 boost converter without an on board DVM. I would suggest one with DVM, as shown below.

user image

XL6009 references:

DC-DC XL6009 Digital Boost Step Up Power Supply Module Adjustable 4.5 – 32V to 5-52V Step-up Voltage Regulator With LED Voltmeter HKD17.65
aliexpress.com/item/…

(see full text)

5 hours later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

Mon 15:44

Warning to the OP:

(1) Why 18650 Battery Would Explode – DNK Power
dnkpower.com/…

(2) Should you be worried about exploding Lithium Ion batteries? – Aries RC 2016
youtube.com/…

1 hour later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

Mon 16:53

More 1S protection board for double safety:

1S 3.7V 3A li-ion BMS PCM Battery Protection Board DC 4.2`5V CC/CV PCM for 18650 Lithium Ion Li Battery – AliExpress HK7/5pcs
aliexpress.com/item/…

(see full text)

4 hours later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

Mon 20:33

Now I am going to test the TP4056 module with protection circuit.

user image

1 hour later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

Mon 21:37

TP4056 Cheat Sheet

TP4056 1A Standalone Linear Li-lon Battery Charger with Thermal Regulation in SOP-8 Datasheet – NanJing Top Power ASIC
dlnmh9ip6v2uc.cloudfront.net/…

user image

tlfong01

tlfong01

Mon 21:50

DW01 Troubleshooting Cheat sheet.

DW01 One Cell Lithium-ion/Polymer Battery Protection IC Datasheet – PingJinSemi
datasheet.lcsc.com/lcsc/…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

Mon 22:43

user image

15 hours later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

Tue 13:14

There are two kinds of 18650 batteries: without or with built in IC (DW01) protection. I am going to test the one without protection.

Nitecore NL1835 NL835HP rechargeable battery 18650 3.6V Li-ion 3500mAh Output 2A (no built in protection) – AliExpress HK$132 (US$17)
aliexpress.com/item/…

user image

1 hour later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

Tue 14:41

Now I am charging up 4 NiteCore 2A, no protect 18650 samples for preliminary testing. These 4 things have charge in the range 4.18V~4.20V. So I guess they are almost fully charged.

user image

Now I am reading the user manual:

NiteCore DigiCharger D4 User Manual – NiteCore
charger.nitecore.com/Uploads/…

tlfong01

tlfong01

Tue 15:22

Electric Danger of Lithium Ion 18650 – Battery Fires Exposed – Possible DIY Solution
youtube.com/…

3 hours later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

Tue 18:39

Now all 4 lipo batteries have finished charging. All measured 4.20V. Next step is testing the boost module XL6009.

user image

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

Tue 19:31

XL6009 Step up/Boost Converter Troubleshooting Warning.

The OP seems to connect output of TP4056 (18650) max 4.2V to the input of XL6009 boost converter to step upto 12V to drive a 12V BLDC motor. WARNING However, the minimum input voltage to XL6009 is 5V. So there is no guarantee that XL6009 should work.

Perhaps we should try MT3608 with input minimum voltage of 2V.

(1) XL6009 Datasheet – HaoYue
haoyuelectronics.com/…

(2) XL6009 Step-up Power Module DC-DC Converter – ICStation
instructables.com/…

(3) MT3608 1.2MHz 2A Step Up Converter – AeroSemi
olimex.com/Products/…

(4) LM2596 3A Step-Down Switching Regulator Datasheet – OnSemi
onsemi.com/pdf/datasheet/…

(see full text)

3 hours later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

Tue 22:09

More Lipo Experiments:

(5) Will China’s 18650 Battery Beat LG, Samsung, Sony & Panasonic? Let’s find out!
youtube.com/…

(6) Li-Ion battery short circuit, overcharge, undervoltage EXPERIMENT
youtube.com/…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

Tue 22:59

Now I am testing if XL6009 specified min 5V input can work with Lipo output 3.7V to 4.2V.

user image

13 hours later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

Wed 11:39

Before my 18650 lab testing, I am watching more videos on how others are doing.

How to TEST 18650 cells (Samsung, LG, China OEM, …)
youtube.com/…

2 hours later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

Wed 13:37

Now I am going to do a stretch stretch test on the boost converter XL6009. The AliEx user guide seems not very clear, so I need to google the Chinese version to clarify.

user image

2 hours later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

Wed 15:41

New XTW6009 vs Old XL6009 Boost Converter:

So I googled for the XL6009 module user guide. I had a pleasant surprise! My XL6009 module is actually updated to XTW6009 with a wider input range of 3V ~ 32V!

In other words, my original conclusion that XL6009 not good for 3.7V Lipo cell input was wrong! This saves me much time of using my digital storage PSU (Riden RD6006) to verify XL6009 for oust of spec calibration/verification.

XTW6009 Boost Converter Chinese User Guide:

penzu.com/p/a81e30fd

tlfong01

tlfong01

Wed 16:32

***3V ~ 32V*** input to 5V~40V output DC-DC Step Up Power Supply Module XL6009 [XTW6009] Adjustable Boost Regulator Module Super LM2577 – AliExpress
aliexpress.com/item/…

6 hours later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

Wed 22:19

The OP’s 12V 0.4A BLDC motor has the following spec:

I think it is similar to the following:

(1) Gdstime 7525 (75x50mm) DC12V 0.4A 2-pin Sleeve Bearing Brushless Sleeve Blower Cooling Fan

I think it is just an ordinary blower fan. So I will just get an common DC12V 2-pin computer cooling fan for testing.

GdsTime 7525 fan references:

(1) Gdstime 7525 (75x50mm) DC12V 0.4A 2-pin Sleeve Bearing Brushless Sleeve Blower Cooling Fan
(2) Gdstime 5015 50mm DC 24V 12V 5V 2Pin Ball/Sleeve Bearing Brushless Cooling Turbine Blower Fan 50mm x 15mm Blower Cooler Fan – AliExpress HK$66/2pcs
aliexpress.com/i/…

(see full text)

12 hours later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

Thu 10:45

I don’t have any “Sleeve Bearing Brushless Cooling Turbine Blower Fan” in hand, so I will just find any BLDC motor to do the OP’s test. Usually BLDC motor has a couple of wires to control speed and direction, so make the test simple, I will just short the PWM/speed and direction signal wires to Vcc, to make it a 2-pin wire similar to the OP’s BLDC motor. The BLDC I will be using is the following:

Brushless DC motor with built in controller – EESE 2021, Viewed 565 times
electronics.stackexchange.com/…

As I found a very good spec on XTW6009 which accepts low Lipo 3.7V/3V input, so I will forget other alternatives like MT3608, LM2596 etc. Now I am going back to do a second/follow up test on TP4056 (with protection DW01 and dual N-channel power MOSFET).

2 hours later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

Thu 12:59

Now I have wired up and testing the following:

1. Lipo 3.7V single cell,

2. XTW6009 step up module, stepping up from 3.7VDC to 12VDC.

3. DC12V DC motor (note: not BLDC, but simple DC which is more newbie proof)

XTW6009 step up power supply unit testing

2 days later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

yst 14:57

Now I am going to test using TP4056 to charge and discharge 18650 batteries. I don’t have that many good quality NiteCore 18650 sample in hand to test, so I will search my junk box for China or India 1860 batteries. I heard that many China OEM batteries has moved to India. So I googled to update myself.

Lithium Battery Manufacturer in India | How are lithium ion Battery Made | UTL Solar
youtube.com/…

1 hour later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

yst 16:05

I found what I found in my junk box are either no brand OEM or ZoneSun from China. So I will be testing them now.

(1) ZoneSun 18650 3.7V with protection – AliExpress
id.aliexpress.com/item/…

(2) ZoneSun 3200mAh 18650 Lion 3.7V with protection board
zonesun.world.taobao.com/…

(3) ZoneSun 3200mAh 18650 Lion 3.7 V with protection – Tmall
detail.tmall.com/…

(4) ZoneCell
zoncell.com

(see full text)

1 hour later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

yst 17:25

So I have wired up my TP4056 to charge up a ZoneSun 3.7V Lipo:

user image

@DavidMcTravord I am using the TP4056 to charge the Lipo cell. The power source for the TP4056 is a 5V wall wart with Type C USB connector, as shown in the picture above.

4 hours later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

yst 21:16

One more thing. You might like to check your XL6009 is indeed marked as XL6009E1. If yes, your step up from 3.7V to 12V might not work at all, because the input range for this old version of XL6009E is only 5V~32V < 3.7V!

user image

18 hours later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

14:48

Now I am setting up my RD6006 PSU at 5V 350mA to test charging 3.7V Lipo with TP4056.

user image

6 hours later…

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

21:18

Now I am trying to use the TP4056 to charge up a Lipo from 2.0VDC to about 3.0VDC. The 18650 is being charged but not discharging at the same time.

tp4056 testing 2022dec0401

The TP4056 will hopefully charge the 18650 cell to a steady 4.2V approximately. This verifies that the charging circuit is more or less working OK.

For now the Lipo cell output is measured by the DVM, but the protection device DW01 output is not yet connected to any load.

tlfong01

tlfong01

7445

21:52

Next step is to test Lipo discharging with DW01 protective cct. The protective cct is two low side switches of N-channel power MOSFET (M1, M2 in the schematic below).

user image

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